General Care Discussion :: "Tired of Caring For Him"

[puppylovejewelry]

Hello all. I'm happy I found this forum. I am a new Turtle mommy as of last Wednesday. I have no idea what I am doing but am trying my best.

My dog is dying of cancer so I took him for a nice long day at our local park. Some teenaged boys came up to pet him and started laughing about how they threw their turtle in the cold pond because they were "tired of caring for him". I flipped out....yelled at them, went looking for the turtle....found him 45 minutes later. I live in Arizona- the pond water was somewhere in the 40's (degrees F) and he was in there for forty five minutes before I found him. He was slowed down enough that I reached in and grabbed him. I called a herpetologist who told me he would surely die in the pond, so i took him home.

He spent the first 24 hours in my 70 degree home slowly warming up as the herpetologist said no sudden changes in temp. I put him in wooden box with a blanket and some rocks. The next morning I bought him a home to get us by until I can afford better (my dog's medical bills have depleted me). I was able to spend $400 to get a basic aquatic turtle starter home kit with an added on top grade turtle filter (Turtle Clean 501 External canister filter), water heater, basking deck and tunnel for hiding. Here is his current set up:



I already know from reading that he needs a bigger home soon and I have to get rid of the rocks at the bottom and replace them with larger ones (I asked the idiot pet store manager about the rocks and he said that was a stupid myth...then I read posts here- the manager was stupid and its not a myth, I need bigger rocks).

He hasn't eaten yet. I have a food made of dehydrated shrimp, worms etc called ZMG Zoo Med Gourmet Aquatic Turtle Food-have offered that and radicchio, romaine, blackberry....no luck yet but the water temp was 72 for first few days, then I got the heater so its now at 78-80 degrees and has been that way for a day. I'm hoping I see him eat soon. If not he will go to the vet sooner rather than later (my vet who sees my guinea pigs is an expert herpetologist, so I plan to get him a good check up as soon as I recover from all my dog's recent medical bills, sooner if there is any evidence of illness but none so far).

His shell is very hard, uniform and healthy. His skin also appears quite healthy, he has some light shedding in the warmer water now. I have seen him yawn and use his paw to clean himself (which is very cute). He was basking alot when the water was colder, now much less since the water is warm.

Questions:

1.) I read its normal for them not to eat at first. At what point will it become medically concerning that he's not eating? Got him on Wednesday, nothing yet but remember the water was at 72 until yesterday.

2.) is he really a he? I think his front nails are long, but not as long as some of the pictures of the male red eared sliders I see online....the bottom of his shell seems totally flat, not concave:




3.) Did I forget anything major? (used drops for the water, have a UVA heat lamp and UVB lamp, basking deck temp is around 85 degrees).


Thank you for the help

[Mo Milazzo]

Ok first off, you're taking exceptional care o this turtle and you obviously know what to correct (tank size and pebbles) when enough money comes around. I commend you on that. As far as substrate you really don't NEED anything on the bottoms of the tank, so if you want to save yourself some money, you don't HAVE to buy any larger stones. Franklin only has a few because he is abnormal and likes to snuggle them. With that said, his tank bottom is not covered with rocks, however it doesn't hurt as long as they are rounded and large. Just thought that could save you a few dollars. I will say, it doesn't cos money to take this small pebbles out ASAP. I would recommend doing it immediately. There are too many horror stories about turtles and pebbles, I can't even...Anyway, to answer your questions when I got Franklin, it was a good 2 weeks before he ate, and he was a hatchling, so I can only imagine how long a larger res can hold out. Plus, considering the whole thrown in a freezing pond factor, I wouldn't have an appetite either. This turtle totally looks like a "she". Which makes me want to know what you plan to call her. This also means that full grown, your looking at atleast a 120 gallon tank when she's full grown. Measure her shell top to bottom and remember, 10 gallons per inch of SHELL, head and tail isn't included. With a tank upgrade, comes a filter upgrade and a tank heater upgrade, which if you don't already have one for this tank, I recommend getting one. Oh and try different commercial foods, like actual pellets. Franklin prefers Reptomin. They are green floating sticks. As far a the food your offering, that should only be a treat, not a stable diet. It makes turtles constipated, or at least it mad my Franklin constipated. If you need anything else, we are here for you!
~Mo

[steve]

Hi, welcome to the forum. The turtle looks to be a female and possible not a RES.

Some quick things... Try to get the water temps up to the upper 70s. Be careful of that heater as more of it should be submerged. It might have a indicator for a water line. Unplug it for about 10 minutes and reposition it. The tank and filter are not good. The filter is weak, the tank is only partially usable and overpriced... watch out for turtle-specific products.

That tank needs to have support along the bottom rim of the tank. The cut out area also greatly weakens the tank in it's current position. Make sure the tank is empty of all water and preferably all other objects before it is moved, Honestly, I'd return it if possible.

You can have a bare bottom tank for now, just get rid of those rocks. Try some white boiled chicken meat, boiled egg whites and live feeder fish (rosey red minnows).

So for you answers..
1 - it depends. Try the things I mentioned.
2 - if that turtle is 4" or larger, then you have a female
3 - the UVB lamp should have a burn in period. Is it a 5.0?

[edit - Mo beat me to the punch (I type slow) and is spot-on.]

[CactusJohn5]

Firstly, i am sure "she" is in shock, trama from getting "thrown" i am sure the brats threw her into the cold water, and they move to a new home are going to effect how quickly she eats again. Do not worry, RES, and it is safe to say you have an RES from the first picture ?!? Can go months with food, they burmate (SP) which is the turtle form of hibernation. A couple weeks with out eating is very common when moving to a new home.

second, see #1 i am sure it's a female, Males nails are a good 2-3 inches.

thirdly, do not fret about the small details, right now, let her get used to what she has, and get her eating. Once she is settled into, say a month or 2, then you can start making the BIG changes to the tank/habitat.

Want to entice eating, try tuna from a can, or cook some chicken and toss in a couple of pieces, then leave the area.

Do not stress about the costs of a LARGE TANK and a PROPER filter, like i said earlier in time they will come.

[josephkr]

Luckily it seems like RES are pretty resilient and cope with a lot of the mistakes we make along the way. This website is the best place to get answers to all your questions. As for the food everyone is right, he can probably go a while without the food, but just keep offering a little at a time because one day she's going to be interested and very hungry.

[puppylovejewelry]

Thank you everyone for the help and advice. A she eh? augh. the size. oh well, she can't help it that she will grow. I can't turn my back on her. I read it takes a few years so I will start the fund for the $1000 tank now. But I would prefer to get it ASAP. Do any of you use the Acrylic tanks and find them superior in durability or have problems with them? There is a huge aquatic pet store here that sells used displays so I may be able to get a good price on a larger glass tank- but is that safe? What can be done to completely disinfect the living quarters of another animal? I'm thinking possibly nothing.

I am bummed out that so many bad things have been pointed out on what I just spent $400 on. Returning it won't be easy or cheap- I live by bike in a year round fairly warm city to keep life simple and reduce the stress of living off of a small home business. I took a taxi home from the pet shop with all this stuff, would need to haul it back the same way and drive forever to find better. So I think I'm stuck with this set up for the next few months. Probably the next thing I will get her will be her longterm full size home- hopefully she won't have to wait long. I was in a rush to get her anything suitable because of concern for her survival after such a terrible shock. So at least she only spent 24 hours out of water/warmth and is back to what is normal for her. I know she needs more room so I will get her better as soon as I can. I'm getting the rocks out today when i do some cleaning- will tilt the heater on a diagonal so its fully submerged.

How can they be so dumb at the pet store? That guy went on and on laughing at me for my fear of small rocks, saying "you read all kinds of things on the internet" and rolling his eyes. He also told me that this is a reptile- it will never love me back or even care if I am alive or not. I understand it is not a mammal that I can sleep with the way my oldest guinea pig snuggles in with me each night or my dog lies next to me, but animals know energy and love. They understand kindness. That is why even wild animals that don't belong in the city come to my yard along with every stray in town. They know its an animal house. I think this turtle understands she was in danger in that pond and that I wanted to help her and feel kindness toward her. And how could he ever presume to KNOW what these beings feel or don't feel? Idiot.

I had planned to name her "griswold" as I had a hamster years ago with this name. But I can't do that to a lady turtle....will have to think of another name. I like unusual names. My pigs: Puppy, Hoodwin, Reginald, Sebastian, Dobbie Jones, Mouskin, Starbucks, Little Badger, Cedric, Gideon and Gabriel. My dog: Cecil. Will have to think about her name some more now that I know she is a she- thank you for telling me.

Thanks again for all the help and encouragement.

PS-The herpetologist suggested that I if I couldn't keep her, I should consider letting her go again in that same pond in summer when the other red eared sliders who lived there come out of the mud. Would that give her a better life? I read about all the problems with disease when a pet is released in the wild. But also, aren't her behaviors screwed up because she has lived only in captivity? Would it really be a better life? I plan to take good care of her and offer her lots of variety of good quality foods and keep her home clean. But can that ever replace being free in the wild? I think I will get too attached to her by summer to turn her loose, I may already be. Unless of course there is massive agreement that is a far superior life for her kind, in which case I will consider making myself do it. Some one else also said that people with ponds in their yards always want turtles, but too many of them die that way- I don't think that is a superior life unless I really know the people with the yard pond and they are like me with animals.

PPS- yes is definitely a red eared slider, see pix below.

[puppylovejewelry]

oh sorry for all these questions: one more. I have lots of nice large natural garnet crystals and gemstones (1.5-2 inches and bigger) that would look nice on the bottom of her home (left over from my business, pieces too large for jewelry making). Could I sterilize the smooth ones by boiling them in water for an hour or two and use those to give the bottom character and beauty? thanks!

[CactusJohn5]

cool idea with the gemstones!

okay where to start, lol

#1 RES live about 15-20 years in the wild and around 35-40 in captivity: Pets live longer and most of the time healthier in captivity.

#2 can you get a picture of the underside region where the tail is? We should be able to sex her w/o issues then.

#3 if you plan to keep her, i personally would recommend getting a 100 or 150 gallon Rubbermaid stock tank. I have a 300 and it was the BEST investment i have ever made.
http://www.tractorsupply.com/rubbermaid ... ty-2229901

#4 Pet stores sadly care about 1 thing and that is making money: they used to be about helping people, but now it's all about the bottom dollar. True help is from strangers on theses forums! lol I have learned so much from these guys over the last couple years.

[ataraxiamb]

Welcome! I just got here myself, and you've definitely landed in the right place. Before you spend more money, check out the Indoor Habitat forum. There are a ton of inexpensive and innovative DIY ideas there.

[penelope]

I am bummed out that so many bad things have been pointed out on what I just spent $400 on.

Don't say that. I think it is great!
Yes. She will grow and need larger quarters some day, along with all the other stuff (heater, filter, table to put it on, etc. etc.), but if you are saving up for a super turtle home, then no sense running out and and getting a middle-of-the road set-up.

Since you have the cover, if you want to give her a little more swimming room, you can elevate the water level. As long there is enough room for her to get up on her dock (her height with her neck out + about an inch wiggle room). You will just need to elevate the other other lamp to keep a decent distance between her and the light.

I think she is very pretty.
and she looks pretty darn healthy
How big is she? I tried to read through the post, but didn't catch it.

Penelope came from the wild. It took awhile for her to adjust to captivity and "non-wild" food - several weeks if I recall.

If you can swing it, it might pay off to take her for a health check sooner, rather than later. These little ones hide illness quite well. Plus, if the creepy kid tossed her in a pond, who knows how well she was cared for. Once you have the clean bill of health, you have a baseline. So, if shes starts acting odd, you can won't have to guess as to whether "it followed her to your home" or if there is something amiss in her habitat.
After you only need a "healthy turtle check" every other year.

He also told me that this is a reptile- it will never love me back or even care if I am alive or not

That is down right ludicrous! They have personalities and definitely care when you are around - especially if you have food
I will admit, though, that they really have no problem biting the hand that feeds them
Other than that,well....this site and volumes of members pretty much sums it up.

Welcome!!!

[puppylovejewelry]

Thank you everyone. Penelope, I can't fill up this tank more because it came in a kit where I couldn't see- it only goes up half way and there is an opening on the side for a filter or tubes to come out of. Steve was saying it is weak because of this. I am debating if I should return it or not...will take another day to decide. But she is definitely comfortable for now and you are right- I want to save for her permanent large scale home.

Atarax, I will def check out that DIY section, thanks!

John, that was a good answer about them living longer in captivity. If you have a devoted owner, I'm sure it can be a nice life.

I'm already fascinated by these creatures.....was watching you tube vids of their mating dance today- hilarious!

I think she is pretty too. Her name is going to be Rain (for short, her full name is Rainforest Jasper, because she has all the same colors on her as that type of jasper...and I like how Rain sounds for short).

No comments yet on if it is safe to boil my gemstones rocks and then put them in her cage. I found other stuff online that said to either boil them or freeze them for several days or both. I'll probably do both.

I got all the little rocks out today and changed over her water because at first I was using the little over the side aquarium filter that came with the starter kit and it got dirty. She looks very peaceful right now in 79 degree crystal clear waters.

Should I let sunlight shine on her shell for an hour a day (the pet shop guy advised this so of course I am highly leary of the advice)?

I think you are right about her going to the vet sooner than later. This past month has been a nightmare with my dog...I am working overtime on my little business to recover the funds from his care (THANK GOD he was insured. But still a couple of thousand in expenses for me even with his 90% coverage insurance). As soon as we are in good shape for all the bills, I will take her to my vet. he will be excited I'm sure. He is very good...has done a couple of surgeries on my pigs in the past. He is the only guy in my city who really knows how to care for reptiles.

Thanks again everyone for the help. John was right- this is by far the best way to learn to give proper care. I knew to go looking for a forum because of my experience using them to care for the guinea pigs. The forum posters often know more than the vets about guinea pigs and what to do for them.

[penelope]

Real, outdoor sunshine is the best! Great for a healthy shell. Beats any other lights hands down.
Sunshine through a window really holds no health value.

Rain is a beautiful name.

[sophie anne]

I'm new to this, but I've been looking at a lot of pictures of turtles since I fell into the care of two RES a couple weeks ago (who came from similarly horrifying circumstances).

I think Rain looks like she might be a Belize Slider?
http://www.austinsturtlepage.com/Care/c ... slider.htm

Beautiful turtle no matter what the subspecies though She is SO lucky to have you!!!!

[ataraxiamb]

He also told me that this is a reptile- it will never love me back or even care if I am alive or not.

So untrue. I got attached very early. When I first met Bill, I asked his former owner if I could pet him, and she shrugged and said, "I never tried before." She took terrible care of him and abandoned him with me.

I would give her a couple of days before you try to pet her. She's been through a lot of trauma and is probably a little bewildered. When you do want to pet her, pick her up under her arms and hold her body so she is secure. She will wiggle around a lot, so make sure you are near the tank (or some safe surface that isn't a long fall to the floor), so if she wriggles out of your hand(s), she will not take a fall and hurt herself. Bill will tolerate having his head stroked and being talked to for maybe 20 seconds at a time. I try to do this at least every other day so he remains "socialized", but not so much that he is annoyed. Rain will let you know when she has had enough. She will start ducking her head back into her shell or hint that she can bite you. Bill is polite enough to open his mouth once or twice to remind me he can bite me and once hissed to indicate he had enough. He has never bitten me, probably because I have not hand-fed him, so he does not associate my fingers with food.

He is definitely a ham and wants me to watch him (except when he is basking). If we make eye contact while he is basking, he will jump off the rock. He seems to recognize me, because he has scurried under his rock before when an unfamiliar person walked too close to his tank and he does not run away to hid when I put my hand in the tank to move something or handle him.

[steve]

@sophie anne - I'm also thinking she might not be 100% RES... not that there is anything wrong with it.

A used 100 gallon tank and stand can be found for around $100. Acrylic are lighter and clearer but cost a lot more and will get scratched. Almost all tanks can be cleaned up and resealed if necessary. A tank must be properly supported. A 20 gallon tank filled can weigh 170 pounds. A 100 gallon tank filled will weigh around 900 pounds.

You're not the first to be pulled into a pet store and waste a lot of money. The only thing that is usually a must buy is a water heater, the rest can be a creative solution or bought online later.

I don't get the guy at the pet store... you have a responsibly for your turtle, regardless of what feelings are involved and by whom.

What kind of herpetologist would recommend releasing a captive animal? That makes no sense.

How well do garnet crystals and gemstones normally do underwater? I'd be careful about any chips and cracks, especially since RES are know to be rough and like to redecorate.

Sunlight is good, but beneficial rays are blocked by glass. If it's warm outdoors, do you have a place to let her out to roam? If so I would recommend it however they need constant supervision unless in some enclosure. They are faster than you think and blend in very well with their surroundings. If you just let sun shine into the tank, you will have alga problems and temperature spikes.