Habitat - Indoor :: Media setup

[MerryMenagerie]

This is the one that was recommended, so it was what I bought:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/251099558452?ss ... 1439.l2649

Max tank size:100 gallons
Recommended tank size: 30-75 gallons

[VeipaCray]

atm. it seems like your tank is undergoing the cycling process, reduce the feeding, or even feed outside the tank in order to aid the cycling process. This will prevent the saturation of bio load for your beneficial bacteria. Also, do the 30% water changes once every week.

The "bio load" is what creates the cycle. The bacteria will colonize and populate to match it's food source (assuming you have enough surface area to house the bacteria). If you take measures to reduce the amount of ammonia / nitrite, you will essentially reduce the size of the nitrifying bacteria colony. When you then re-introduce your full bioload, your nitrifying bactera colony will need to repopulate to a size to match the new food source thus kicking off a second mini cycle. Changing water is much the same. During the cycle, much of the nitrifying bactera is free floating as it's reproducing rapidly. Changing water just removes the bacteria that we want and prolongs the cycle.

Ensure that you are using a water conditioner like prime, to remove the chlorine with each water change. This will remove both chlorine and chloramines that will kill your beneficial bacteria, and thus restart the whole process. (The nitrogen cycle is what keeps your water pure**, lower amounts of harmful nitrogenous compounds)

You do not want to use a water conditioner. Filtering your water through carbon will remove the chlorine and chloramine the same way a conditioner will... only WITHOUT adding other dangerous chemicals to your water. Prime is a decent conditioner, but most of the others contain a chemical called sodium theosulfate. You can search this forum for additional info on water conditioners and their negative effects on your turtle. Prefilter the water with carbon (see the equipment section for a device to help), OR you can use water from your fridge if it has a carbon filter. You can use a pitcher like a Pur or Britta. Even the carbon in your canister will do the trick over a few days. You will NOT kill off enough of your nitrifying bacteria population to start a full cycle. You won't even kill off enough to start a mini cycle that you'd notice.

[VeipaCray]

(taken from the amazon link you provided)

Brand: SunSun
Model: HW-302
Max Flow Rate: 265 GPH (1000L/h)
· Hose size: 3/4"
· Max-H: 4.6 feet


So that means the pump will do 265 GPH with no media and no head (height of hose the pump has to push water up and fight gravity).
At 4.6 feet there is no water flow hence the Max Head rating.

When we put media in a filter, we reduce the water flow anywhere from 20-33% on average depending on the type of media used.
Let's use a 25% reduction for the sake of this explanation. .75 x 265 = 198. Let's call it 200GPH for easy math once there's media in the filter.

Now we have to deal with height. Unfortunately it's not a straight graph and not easy to calculate head and flow rate. Good filter manufacturers and good pump manufacturers will publish charts and flow rates. Obviously for that price sunsun doesn't publish much.

Luckily there are people who do test these things and publish their findings for the rest of us.

This is a great article on this filter http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/sh ... p-amp-test
If you don't want to read the entire article here is the key point:

"I decided also to do a GPH test since most canisters are overrated by 1/3 to ½ their true operating GPH. Using 2 5 gallon water bottles and a stop watch I observed the emptying of one bottle and the filling of the second. With the ¾ hoses with not necked down end fittings of ½” the average GPH was 165 GPH. With the small ½” end fittings attached the GPH average was 150 GPH.

So with the head of the sink this guy was using in his tests he saw 150-165 GPH. Now a faucet sink is usually less height than a canister in a stand to the top of an aquarium... so let's use the 150 GPH number.

We're looking for 3-5x turnover of aquarium water per hour with a turtle. More is always better.
Your sunsun filter SHOULD handle somewhere between 30-50 turtle gallons IF you have the proper media setup.
If you are really close to that max head height of 4.6, then your filter's pump isn't strong enough and the volume of water it will handle is significantly less.

[MerryMenagerie]

So if I'm understanding correctly, I don't think I've exceeded the head height. I did cut some length off the tubing. I'm not at home right now but when I am, I'll measure and take more pictures. I appreciate all the input I'm getting on this topic.

[VeipaCray]

No problem. I think everyone on this forum wants to help each other its a great place. Yes, the canister needs to be below the tank as it is a gravity fed siphon that feeds water into the tank. Ideally, the least amount of head height (but still under the tank) is best.

If you only have 40 gallons of water in your tank, this filter should be able to get the job done.

[MerryMenagerie]

It's definitely below, I had a stand built just for this reason. I bought test strips, they were all I could find for now. I will order a kit if needed. It looks like GH is 60, KH is 80, pH is 6.0, nitrite is a hot pink color not found on the chart, so maybe a 10? And nitrate looks similar to 160, but not an exact match.

The hose is 36 inches long. 24 inches were cut off.

http://i1347.photobucket.com/albums/p71 ... 575634.jpg

[steve]

Speaking of sponges.. I have a Rena XP3 and it comes with 4 sponges that I use in the bottom canister. There are 2 fine sponges and 2 regular sponges (wider holes). I have noticed that the bottom sponge gets all cakes with brown goo in like 2 weeks and I have to rinse it really well and put it back in. Should I take one of the fine sponges out? I am thinking it may help with the flow of water being more fast.

Just wondering because it really cakes up on the bottom sponge when I clean the canister out.

As long as the water flow and quality are fine, I wound't worry about it. Like you said, if you want to increase the water flow, then you can certainly remove or change it.

[VeipaCray]

GH, KH, pH are somewhat useless at this point. All you care about measuring is ammonia and nitrite. We need to get that ammonia to spike then drop to 0.... same with the nitrite. We want both of those to stay at 0 then we know the tank is cycled. Fixing clarity and everything else we can work on once you're cycled.

What does your media setup in the canister look like? For a turtle we need about 1/3rd of the filter to be mechanical filtration. We need about 50% of the filter to be ceramic bio media. We need the last 10-12% to be a bag of carbon or both carbon and purigen. There's no exact science to the ratios... just what I've found to work best based on my own filter usage and feedback from others on this forum.

The key to a great turtle filter is really just high flow rate and holds a LOT of media. Turtles produce more waste so we need more filter space to house more media to deal with it. As you can see from your nitrite measurements having a LOT of ceramic bio media is key.

[MerryMenagerie]

I wasn't sure what to replace the white sponges with, so decided to try marineland right size filter pads, which come in a rectangle and I cut to fit the tray. Two of them fit in the bottom tray. In the middle tray is a coarse sponge, the one it came with, I just rinsed it, and put it back in. There is a bag of carbon in this tray as well. In the top tray it is 2/3rds ceramic rings, and the rest is bioballs.

[VeipaCray]

Ah HA! You don't have enough bio media.

Option 1 (more bio media)> Put the coarse sponge on the bottom tray with the bag of carbon on top. Fill the top two trays with ceramic bio media. As much ceramic media as you can fit and still get the filter to go back together. Ditch the bioballs... they're a waste of space in the canister.

Option 2 (more mechanical)> Put the coarse sponge on the bottom with one of the right size pads on top. Put the bag of carbon in the bottom of the second tray and fill the rest of the second and top trays with as much ceramic bio media will fit.

If you can get the tank to cycle and stay cycled with option 2... that will give you a bit more mechanical filtration. If option 2 doesn't get your ammonia / nitrates to 0, then try option 1.

[MerryMenagerie]

I just ordered more ceramic rings, so I will change it up as soon as they get here. Thanks!

[MerryMenagerie]

I've also been reading about prefilters, but I can't tell if it might help or hurt the tank. Is it just a sponge in or around the intake? What about a hydor koralia to help keep the water moving?

[VeipaCray]

Prefilters are just another way to add some mechanical filtration to your filter setup. If you want to make a cheap one you can rubber band some filter floss or sponge around the canister intake. The problem with them is that they often become clogged quickly creating a nitrate factory inside your tank if they aren't cleaned / changed regularly.

The hydor or any other powerhead can help with water movment if you have stagnant areas of the tank where waste is collecting. You don't need water flow for health of your turtle.

[MerryMenagerie]

Can you recommend a good size for a 55 gallon? There are definitely areas where debris or waste collects. Would you recommend two smaller pumps, or 1 bigger one?

[VeipaCray]

Would you instead consider a second sunsun filter? You could double your filtration, add flow and perhaps solve all of the issues in one shot.