Equipment Review and Discussion :: is redwood toxic for turtles, fish, biofilter? is PVC?

[V Lou]

I am considering what the right material could be to use for some of the structure of my above-water basking/roaming area. I was going to use copper. Not good for the biofilter.... water would splash onto the copper and perhaps get into the water, I guess.

This material will be above water, although it will get wet, and is needed to help support the plexiglass walls of their above-aquarium basking area.

It's sort of the Good, Bad and Ugly. The copper turns out to be the Bad, although it would have been handsome. I guess Redwood would be the Good and PVC would be the Ugly .

Which to use.... is there anything about redwood that would be toxic to my habitat inhabitants? is there anything toxic about pvc for the turtles, fish or biofilter microbes?

I'm hoping I'll hear, "Go ahead and use the copper!" "It may be bad, but it's handsome."

[jay2487]

I wouldn't use the copper, I'm not sure about the redwood but I would guess it would be fine. The PVC you know would be fine. That green stuff that grows on copper will make YOU sick so I wouldn't want it around my turtle.

[V Lou]

I used to put a copper penny in my fish aquar., because copper discourages fungus, but I recently read that it would be bad for a biofilter, too. I don't know more than that. Be sure not to put anything "silver" in a fish tank, b/c silver kills fish and bacteria for certain.

[papoopeepoo]

V Lou is right.

I'm pretty sure it's the ionization of the metal with the water that kills the growth. Plus, who knows what could be on that coin!

Keep coins, and erector set pieces , out of the aquarium.

[V Lou]

I need to get a digital camera.... oh, and learn how to post a picture But, that will be a while and I am building this structure now. If my following description raises any Red Flags, Please, Please post a reply so I can change something, if I need to.

I decided to use the redwood and started building the second story above my aquarium yesterday. I hope that it is okay to use redwood. It is not "in" the water, but it will get wet. I will hope that whatever the water extracts from the wood won't be toxic.

So, this is what I have going:
I am using a redwood-framed, vinyl-coated, wire mesh to support the raised basking area. The wire mesh extends into the water as its own ramp. I will lightly coat all of the wire's vinyl with aquarium 100% silicone, drying it overnight, before actually using it. The silicone should seal any metal which might otherwise have been exposed to the water.
The basking area wire mesh is/will be covered with a high-density vinyl-type of shelf liner, common stuff. Very thin, flexible and lacy. I'm sure that must be okay. It's very soft for the turtles. And over that are mosaic tiles of light-colored, smooth, natural stone. I intend the stones to keep most of the hot spot heat, rather than letting it pass through to the water below. We'll see if that works. And I would like their light color to reflect UVs upward, just as pond water does in the wild as they would sun themselves on a log (getting UVs from above and below).

Redwood frames the plexiglass used for the front and side walls of their basking enclosure. There is a hinged plexi. front door to access them (to give them their food or whatever). White plastic grid is used as the back wall. The whole redwood framed wall assembly lifts off of the aquarium easily. (Clamps hold it in place.) The basking area lifts off once the wall assembly is off.

Making this has been really fun. My room for the turtles will be ready in a few days, too.

Does anyone see any Red Flags? I plan to eventually have mollies, guppies and swordtails in with the turtles.

Thank you in advance for your help

[jay2487]

Nope sounds great!! I would suggest you get an api master test kit and fully cycle that tank before adding any livebearers to it. It will keep them alive and fast so your turtle doesn't eat them to quick. It might already be cycled from the turtles waste though but check before you add fish.

[V Lou]

Thank you! What is an api kit?
I have chemical test kits. So love the lab aspect of this.... I have pH, something for nitrogen. I should check to be sure it does NH3/NH4, nitrite, nitrate. Thank you for mentioning it. I am guessing api has something to do with chemical tests... ?
Tomorrow is my deadline to have the second story built. I so can't wait.
I bought the potable hose today and another heater. I plan to start adding water to the aquarium tonight, heating it a few gallons at a time. I promised my turtles they would be out of my bathtub by tomorrow night. They are so tired of white!!
This is beyond Exciting!!!

[jay2487]

API is just a brand name
http://www.google.com/products/catalog? ... BUQ8gIwAA#

Tetra makes a good one too. There are cheaper ones but I find that they aren't as precise. You need to keep track of PH, ammonia, nitrates and nitrites. If you have the perfect parameters, good filtration and a good amount of beneficial bacteria growing you can go a year without doing a water change or vacuuming your substrate as the bacteria will eat all leftover food waste and waste left by the turtle and turn it into another type of food which can be absorbed by live plants you keep in the tank. So if all works well together your tank will keep itself clean and healthy.

[V Lou]

Thank you for writing. I am getting ready to go to the pet store now, b/c my Mardel intank live-pH/live-NH3/temp meter says my NH3 is in the caution range and my pH is above 8. So, I need some buffer, something to get my pH down and some test strips to monitor ammonium, nitrite and nitrate. My Eheim is so awesome, but it doesn't yet have sufficient bacterial count to be of use in that regard. Yikes!! I removed/replaced about a third of the water, but the levels are still in the caution range.

The turtles LOVE their habitat (I'm worn completely out from building it and versions 2,3,4,5) and they have much to explore still (I need to get a camera). They use their familiar dock (the secondary hot spot), but are timid to venture up onto their new, second story, primary, roomy basking area.

I hope Petco/smart has buffer, something to lower the pH, and test strips. I have a dozen d.zibras in the tank to entertain the turtles, so I have to get the water corrected pronto, especially for the zibras' sakes.

[V Lou]

Well, here it is one month later and all is so fine. The water quality is great, the turtles are so happy and I bought colorful fish in addition to the zibras. Such a fantastic little eco system. It's amazing how it all came together so well.

[jay2487]

Also, I should have said this earlier but, don't buy anything that chemically adjusts PH. It is useless. Your turtle doesnt care at all and your fish will much rather have a constant high PH than the fluctuating PH you get when adding chemicals. I wouldnt even worry about PH unless you have a toxic level of ammonia you just cant get rid of, which shouldnt happen. If you must try to get it down though, untreated driftwood, from freshwater, will turn the tank a little brown but that stuff turning it brown is called tannic acid and it lowers PH. Also you can buy peat floss or pellets for the filters to lower PH naturally, old dried oak leaves work great, or, the coolest way to me, get a hollowed out coconut shell and drop it in. It wont foul the water as bad as driftwood and it does just as good and looks cool. Now, if you go buy driftwood for an aquarium at the fish store, it will be pre-treated and wont have tannic acid in it. If it doesnt somewhat turn the water tea colored its not working. At the same time if you get a piece of driftwood from the beach, it has also lost all tannins and replaced them with shale and salt particles, this will raise PH to 9 levels quick so make sure it came from freshwater. Whatever you do dont use chemicals, the fish hate it and the turtles drink it and the first time your not paying attention and do a water change, the PH shoots back up and all your fish are super stressed or dead, if they survive you add the PH down and they really die. It's just not a good system

[V Lou]

Thank you so much for all of that information! Way good to know, and to find another analytic!!

Actually, all is so fine. The pH is staying right around 7 now. There is no nitrite or ammonia and the nitrate is being consumed by a ton of plants, with just a bit of algae (the snails are glad about that) growing in the tiny crevices of the Zoo Med dock.

Talk about eco system!! This is so cool:
I bought more plants b/c 2 of my mollies are getting ready to drop some fry; more plants for the fry to hide in. --- I wasn't planning entirely on having fries, since I thought the turtles would eat the fish (mollies, swordtails, guppies, zibra and glo danyos), but Noooooo, they adore the fish! They are polite, get out of the fishes' way if the fish are eating their turtle sticks , or if the fish are near a rock the turtles want to check out, they wait until the fish have passed, soooooooo polite and adorable. Regular Disneyland movie.

Anyway, once I positioned the new plants for the fish fry nursery, for the first time I saw a new born swordtail. Huge eyes for a head and a bit of black at its tail, as small as a baby's first fingernail clipping. It's been 3 days now and it is getting a little red-orange around its abdomen; not sure if that's red as in heart, or skin color.... It either came with my new plants, or one of my swordtails had a baby, if it is a swordtail.

Anyway, guess where the safest spot in the tank is, according to this adorable fry,... ? The turtles' back! Yes! It hangs on as a turtle swims and disembarks when it gets across the tank to a neater looking spot. And, the rest of the time, it hangs out in the shallow water of the turtles' Zoo Med dock ramp, staying as close as possible to the turtles, who are usually sleeping on the dock. Coinsidence, I'm sure. But, still cute. I can't wait until the black mollie babies arrive.

This is by far the most wonderful hobby. My turtles are so polite and well mannered, very, very happy; they must get it from my cats ... or maybe it's from the ambiance of my home,.... that's it!!! It's all the tranquility.... this place is steeped in tranquility. Either the Disney film crew or the Dahli Lama will show up any day now........

[jay2487]

lol, im glad its working out, while my turtles are definitely not polite and will eat any mollie or swordtail or cichlid for that matter if given the chance, all my fish I believe have adapted now and know how not to get eaten. Because of that the turtles have realized its a waste of time trying to catch them and dont actively chase them for 30 minutes like he did when I first got him. And because the oldest doesnt and looks at the younger ones like there stupid when they do, they dont chase anymore either. It all works out beautifully

[V Lou]

[V Lou]

This has got to beat all...for me at least. Remember how I said my turtles are so polite (I know, it will end one day:), well this takes the cake....

This morning I fed my two turtles salmon. It was time for a long-chain-omega-3-FA-boost, I felt, it's been a couple of months maybe. Anyway, chunks of cooked salmon going in, turtles all excited, downing salmon chunks as fast as they can, and the fish were checking it out. The fish took the little flakey pieces floating freely and ran with them. Pretty soon, everyone in the tank knew and it was like a shark frenzie!! 25+ fish and two turtles, mouths everywhere, color everywhere and then a fight broke out!!!

One of the red swordtails had a "chunk", I don't mean a fish-sized piece, ...a moderately sized Chunk! He tried to haul off with it, dashing away from the swirl of bodies and mouths. One of the turtles spied that chunk trying to make a run for it and took off after it. Oh, no, I thought. The swordtail was almost exactly the same color of red as that chunk of salmon... and how did that translate in a turtle's eye? Would he be able to distinquish the two apart? Oh, my Gosh!!! This was happening really FAST!! The turtle was not remembering about being polite!!! He was just going all out to catch that chunk that was getting away!!!

But, I've raised my turtles well. It turned out okay in the end... ...The swordtail started tight circle swimming with the chunk at the hub. The swordtail was making fast circles, his body protecting the chunk from the attempts being made by the turtle to snatch it away.

I was so afraid the swordtail was going to disapear, or maybe half of it, into the turtle's chomping mouth. It was getting so tight, so close, flesh to flesh, so frantic!!! Yikes!! Amazing, fish body swirling, twisting, frantically making a shield out of its own bulk, using its side profile to cover/protect the chunk, flashing this way and that - the turtle very clumsy in comparison, but he made up for that with his really-big-mouth.

I was scared to the max, holding my breath, not able to breathe and at that same moment, as all was going into slow motion mode for me, unable to think what I should/could do to help the swordtail, my turtle changed; apparently it had become way to intense for him, too. He was chomping at, yet still missing that piece of salmon, but suddenly he appeared conscious of the live fish; he was doing some aquatic sidesteps, sort of, a double-take. Maybe he realized now that there were two entities - the swordtail and the salmon- at any rate, he made obvious efforts in his clumsy attempts to now be careful to not bite the swordtail. WoW! Amazing. He is a good turtle . He lessened his charge a bit, the swordtail quit swirling and... my turtle simply took the piece of salmon from the swordtail precisely and carefully, rather matter of fact. Done deal.

Geeze -- I had witnessed my turtle's thought process in action. It was logical and fairly complex, and there was kindness, thrown in for the surprise icing on the cake.