General Care Discussion :: General Advice for a New Owner

[missmandible]

I bought 2 red eared sliders from a pet market in Shanghai 5 days ago. They are about 2 inches long each, and the tank is definitely large enough to accomodate both of them (I'm not sure how many gallons it is). They have a large basking area, plenty of sunlight, and a 40 watt light since it's pretty chilly here now, and I clean their tank at least once every 2 days (both filters I have purchased have been broken, but I will buy another over the weekend)
In the past 5 days, neither of the turtles have eaten. I've tried pellets, live shrimp, and meal worms, but they're not interested in any of it. Sometimes I think they're unaware of the food because they are ALWAYS SLEEPING. Yes, I've tried feeding them while they were awake.
One of the turtles seems to be in a better condition than the other. One day I approached the tank while she was on the basking rock and she was startled and fled to the water. I consider this to be a good sign, but most of the time neither of the turtles react to me (ALWAYS SLEEPING).
The other turtle may have an infection in her eyes. They don't look swollen, but they look like they she can't open them. Two days ago she was able to open one of them partially. This turtle is more lethargic than the other, spending more time in the water than basking.
Right now I have both turtles 'soaking' in medicine that I purchased from the pet market. I think it is a combination of vitamins. In Chinese it's called Tain Nian, and the ingredients listed are Manganese Sulfate, D-Tocopherol, Manadio sodium bisulfate yeast. That might be misspelled as it is a translation. The man at the pet market told me to put them in this powder mixed with shallow water for 3 days then let them dry out for a full day.
Neither of the turtles has shell damage, and their skin looks OK, but I worry because they sleep so much, are lethargic, won't eat. and because one might have an eye problem. I am a teacher, and all the turtles at my school are very active all day long, and they aren't kept in the best conditions (no heaters, tanks are too small, not enough sunlight-I'm in the process of fixing all of this).
Any advice on what I can do to improve this situation and make my turtles happy? Am I being paranoid because I am a new mother?

[octpusgirl8]

It sounds like your turtles may be sick. Swollen eyes can indicate several problems, ranging from vitamin deficiency to a respitory infection. If you can, i would get them checked out by a vet, the soaks aren't likely to do anything. As far as general care information, check out these links: http://www.redearslider.com/index_basic_care.html
Don't feel bad, you didn't make them sick, they were most likely sick when you got them, even if they weren't showing any symptoms yet. Good luck!

[megcornell]

If I read your description right the biggest problems are lethargy and the possible eye infection.
What kind of set up do you have the turtles in and what is the water temperature? It should be around 78F for hatchlings. If the temp is too low the turtles will be lethargic and refuse to eat. Buying a water heater will easily solve that issue. But the longer they're in cool water the more susceptible they are to serious ailments such as respiratory infections.
For the eyes you can apply cod liver oil in case it is caused by a vit A deficiency. If you can get zoo med turtle eye drops where you are that would be a better alternative but if you cannot cod liver oil will be good.
It's normal for new turtles not to eat for a few days at first because they are stressed and adjusting to the new environment.
I'm not sure what the powder you're using is, but I'd discontinue it and use the cod liver oil instead.
Like octopusgirl said, the turtles were ill when you got them so it's tough to know what's wrong and how long it's been going on-- increasing their water temp and treating their eyes will certainly give them a much better shot at life than they had at the vendor's.
Good Luck.

[missmandible]

I don't think I can get zoo med turtle products here. I've never actually seen a real pet store in China. You would probably be outraged by the conditions at the pet market.
Cod Liver oil...how do I apply it? Drip it on the eyes? How often and for how long should I use this treatment?
This may be a stupid question, but is there a possibility the turtles just don't want to open their eyes? One of the turtles at my school has a severe eye infection. It's eyes are really bulgy and look like they are covered by grey matter...it's also starting to get bloated under its shell. My turtles eyes don't look like this. It looks like they just keep their eyes closed all the time (I know one can definitely open its eyes).
I have also heard of people dissolving multi- vitamins (Centrum) in their turtle's tank to boost the vitamins. It was recommended by a vet, but I assume this would be a bad idea...
I'm also discovering white bumps on one of the turtle's skin. They are on its flippers, and there is one on its neck underneath the crease part. Any ideas on what this might be and how I can help?
Today I took the turtles to an expensive vet, but she didn't know anything. She used the internet while I was in the office to try and diagnose what might be the problem. I think it will be difficult to find a vet with this specialization in China.

[marisa]

Hi, missmandible,

If you turtle does have a vitamin A deficiency, try putting some plain cod liver oil on a q-tip and gently rubbing the eyelids with it once or twice a day for several days. It should help if that is the cause of the closed eyes (the Vit A content in the cod liver oil is higher that in the Zoo-Med drops). I doubt turtles would knowingly keep their eyes shut---they're normally skiddish and are on the outlook for predators.

From your description, it sounds like the turtle could have a fungus, possibly a systemic infection. Can you post a pic or two of the skin dry showing the bumps?

Adding vitamins to the feeding water (feed in a separate container of water) would be OK to do, and if Centrum is all you can find, it would be better than nothing (I'd dissolve half a tablet in water and add that to the feeding water). If you could find something call Poly-Vi-Sol, a liquid vitamin for babies and children, that would be better. Liquid bird vitamins would also do. You also could cut the water with 50% plain Pedialyte, if you can find that, to provide some needed electrolytes. Gatorade would be a distant second choice.

Do you reside in Shanghai? If it's anything like Hong Kong, I would imagine there must be some stores that cater to foreigners that would have some of the above products or something similar. Is there a zoo or any kind of animal park anywhere near you? Perhaps someone there would know more about turtles.

I know animal markets in China are horrific. Is someone not trying to help that poor turtle at your school?

[SpotsMama]

Turtles won't keep their eyes closed just because they want to unless the light is seriously hurting them. Their most normal response to painful light would be to get away from it - go to a dark area in the tank. Usually keeping the eyes shut is a sign of a problem but it can be any of a number of things. Illness such as a respiratory infection is the most serious. Also, vitamin a deficiency (but you have to be careful not to give too much vitamin a as it is very toxic in large doses), eye infection or injury, and poor water quality (for instance if the water isn't changed often enough and ammonia builds up in it) can also cause them to keep their eyes closed.

To apply cod liver oil to help your turtles' eyes, moisten a q tip with it and apply it gently to the eyelids. Do this once a day for a week and then determine if their eyes are better. You can also soak a few pellets in cod liver oil and feed them to your turtles along with their dry pellets. Don't overdo this though. You don't want your turtle to get an overdose. Three or four pellets in a week would be enough.

Make sure the water temp is warm enough. 78 degrees is good. You might raise it to 80 for awhile since it will help the turtles' immune systems if they are fighting infection.

The white bumps on your turtles skin sound like skin infection or fungus. That makes me think again of water quality. It's probably something else they picked up from where ever it was you bought them. Do you have a water filter in the tank? How often do you change their water? Be sure and keep them very clean - remember that they go to the bathroom in their tank. The first treatment for a skin problem would be a sulfa dip. There's a good dip from Zoo Med called Turtle Sulfa Dip but if can't get it you can try this treatment method that's recommended on another web site:

"This is not an uncommon sight in some species (white patches on the skin). This is your classic skin fungus. Not taken care of, it can enter the blood stream, become septicemic, and destroy certain organs within the body.

Note: The dry-tank method has yielded the highest success rate.

Remove turtle and place in a quarantine tank. The infected areas should be cleaned. Be careful when cleaning out the injury as the infection may have gone deep. Going too deep can cause extreme pain to your turtle.

Listed below is a regimen that I have followed in treating shell and skin problems and has yielded great results. While treating, you are looking for signs of healing and this may take several days before you can actually see a difference. A good idea is to take a clear photograph before treatment and compare it to another photograph of the same area a few days or a week later.

Clean infected areas thoroughly with a strong, undiluted betadine, iodine or Nolvasan solution. Let the turtle air dry in a warm setting for about 45 minutes.

Apply a generous coating of Silvadene cream. Work into problem areas. Neosporin is also an acceptable alternative (Polysporin for those keepers in Canada).

Leave the turtle dry and warm, ensuring that you do not over-heat, for 18-21 hours each day.

The next day, gently clean the affected area with a one of the previously mentioned solutions.

Place them into fresh, clean water. Let them swim, drink and eat for approximately 1 - 1 ½ hours.

Repeat procedure from Step 1.

This treatment performed daily or twice daily, should show you improvements within a week to 10 days."

If the turtles are very tiny, I'd let them swim and eat and drink water two or three times a day instead of just once. Be sure and clean them off again thoroughly before returning them to the dry area.

I'm appalled are the condition of the poor turtle at your school. Sounds like the turtle may be quite ill or suffering from a serious vitamin deficiency. Is there any way you could help him?