General Care Discussion :: New Turtle Keeper - need lots of help!

[TurtleKeeper48]

I'm so glad I found this site. I'm new here and new to keeping Red Eared Sliders. I have a lots questions

We got my son a Red Eared Slider for his b-day. We talked to the reptile expert, bought the "tutles for dummies" book, and everything else we thought we needed, and brought home 'Rosa' - about a 4.5" female RES.

We set up a fairly sparse "20 long" aquarium with a floating dock for Rosa, with a basking light at one end and a pretty good filter. We added a thermometer near the basking area, and in the water and got those temps to where we thought they should be per our book. She seems happy and all seems well.

We do have question about nesting, and egg laying and 'Gravid' turtles - whatever that is, and what we need to provide at some point in that regards. We don't know how to do that.

NOW - AFter a couple of months, long story short, my wife brings home. TWO unkown turtles that a vague aquaintence passed on to her with little info provided. These two - hip and hop, are hibernating in some sort of shredded wood bedding in a very large aquarium, with a dish pan at one end for water and a bridge to get to the water.

They have only "woken up" only a couple of times - but when they did, BOTH appear to be Red Eared Sliders like my sons - except one is much bigger. When they did wake up, once or twice each, they spent a day or two (during hot weather) in the water, then basked and dug themselves back into this bedding and covered themselves up again.

I've read that hibernating for Slider isn't usually advisable? I don't think they are in a very good environment and I want to correct this. I really tried to check them out when they were being active (a couple of days out of the last month or two) and they both look to be female Red Eared Sliders as far as I can tell.

I am completely at a loss. If you read all of this - that is everything I know about the situation and I really want to figure out what will be best for these turles.

I'm thinking that "hip" and "hop" should have their tank set up more like Rosa's tank - but they are asleep and don't want to wake up, I don't know what they'll do if I take all of their bedding away.

-Sorry so long-

I want to learn how to set up a proper environment - for all three.

Help?

[TheComputerGremlin]

First, I believe you are correct in not waking a hibernating turtle. They need to be able to awake on their own, otherwise it can be a system shock. However, if it is summer where you are at, they should not be hibernating. Actually it almost doesn't sound like hibernating, but more actually something metabolic, like they haven't eaten enough and are forced to remain still for the sake of survival.

Whatever you do, do not integrate these existing turtles in with Rosa, she can become very ill. You are correct that they need a similar setup assuming they are sliders. Can you post photos? I know you said they were buried, but see what you can do. Sometimes any bit of shell or flesh can help us ID them. I think the best option would be to somehow design a way that they can get into a tank of water the next time they wake up, and be ready with food. I would go with a high protein piece of boiled chicken or something like that, you need to make them not go back to hibernating.

The next step, IMO, is to get them to a vet. This behavior doesn't sound right and who knows what kind of situation they were in before you got them. If they are in fact sliders, after a 90 day quarantine, you may be able to integrate them, but unfortunately sliders (esp. RES) are very aggressive and someone (like Rosa) may get hurt. It may be best for Hip and Hop to have their own tank.

If your book doesn't say so, you should have 10 gallons of water for each inch of shell, so Rosa at 4.5" should be in a 45 gallon tank, filled to about 2 inches of the top. She can grow as large as 12", which will be a 120 gallon tank. With two additional sliders, that can bring the total to 360 gallons of water ... If this doesn't sound fun (which for many people it doesn't), you may want to consider rehoming Hip and Hop once they are healthy. Read over the main site, www.redearslider.com, for additional information. I don't want to say that your turtle book is wrong, but many books give only the bare minimum for survival, and our site here provides much more optimal conditions.

[theartbook35]

From some strange reason, when people who know nothing of turtles, hear that someone else has a turtle, they automatically assume that that person wants more turtles and hands them off. God I hate that.

It's not unknown to me, to see turtles attempt to bury themselves. I'm not sure the exact reasons, but I saw my turtles do this on a few occasions while they were hatchlings. Usually they burrowed under the substrate and river rocks when something really spooked them. It could be that it is taking them a while to get used to their environment.

They should have one or two plants to hide behind. They might like some fine grain sand, too. Make sure the sand is about an inch to an inch and a half deep. (Do not put heavy rocks on top of the sand, they will dig under it and get trapped or injured. Okay, the thing they are burrowing under, next time they wake up, just take it away and have a normal basking dock to replace it. They'll be mad, probably a little nervous at first, but they will get over it. I would also check the temperatures of the tank's water and basking spot, I'm sure the book you got may have mentioned the right temps, but the water should be between 72 to 78 degrees. The basking spot should be ten degrees higher than the water. I think the person who used to have them, accidentally began to hibernate them, and they need to have that turned off. Captive turtles don't need to hibernate, anyways.

[TurtleKeeper48]

Thanks for the replies. I took some pictures, but I'm not sure how to post them just yet.

I am thinking that a big part of the problem with the burrowed and hibernating turtles has been temperature. The area where they are burried (their land area) has been only slightly above room temp - about 75. When the turtles did wake up and swim and eat and act normal - was when we got a stretch of hot weather and the house was averaging mid to high 80s during the day.


So after reading up today - I got a better heat light set up, and put a thermometer layed on the bedding near the turtles to get an actual temperature. I've been trying to get it right about 85-86. (our tusty book said 85-88 and that seems to work well for our happy turtle)

I'm going to try to maintain that same temp tomorrow and hope that with the warmer temerature they'll wake up and go to the water. There is water available to them and they've been in it before. We put a couple of small feeder fish in the water in case they wake up while we're at work and want some fish.

We'll make sure to feed them well when they wake up, and once they are awake, we plan to get rid of all of the bedding they have now and fill the big aquarium they are in with lots of water and use a floating dock (we have a very large floating dock that was too big for the other turtle) and we hope to see some improvement in that type of environement.

Does that sound like we're on the right track? Hopefully they'll wake up soon.

[TurtleKeeper48]

Hey - While I was typing that, one woke up! Their light is off for the night, and the house is quiet - I was just typing that post before bed - and when I went upstairs, the smaller of the two was in the water tub doing a little late night swimming. I better go give her a little food. Just thought I'd share that. This may be a good sign.

[theartbook35]

Hey - While I was typing that, one woke up! Their light is off for the night, and the house is quiet - I was just typing that post before bed - and when I went upstairs, the smaller of the two was in the water tub doing a little late night swimming. I better go give her a little food. Just thought I'd share that. This may be a good sign.

Sounds like it's going to go okay.

Keep an eye on them, and watch their behavior. If you see anything you think is unusual, please ask us.

Typical weird behaviors: Excessive yawning, sleeping or pawing at face, reduced activity levels for a long period of time, refusing food, no bowel movements.

[TheComputerGremlin]

For posting photos, you need to use an outside photo server. I've used Flickr (free using a Yahoo account) and Facebook, though there are dozens of others. You right click on the photo and select Copy Image Location, and it should copy a url. Then in the chat window here, type [img]followed%20by%20the%20link%20you%20copied%20and%20then[/img] and that should do it. If it doesn't for some reason work quite right, as long as you have that url in the window, one of the members will come along and try to fix it.

That's excellent that one woke up, and the more photo opportunities! 75 degrees is certainly nothing that these turtles aren't used to, so don't make heating up the area a priority. My turtle's tank is at room temperature, which is 73-74 degrees in the water, and the basking area is probably 85-90 degrees, but it's only a small surface.

[TurtleKeeper48]

Thanks. I'll try to post some pictures tonight, after an oil change and a little league baseball game... it might be tomorrow.

Just to be clear - the basking area was only 75 deg at the highest, and the water was probably 72.

When the weather got unsually hot - and the house was up to 85 and so was their basking area, that's when the turtles did wake up the first time.

I have now brought the basking area (where they are dug into bedding) up to 85 or so - the water is still at room temp or a little higher - around 73.

The one that woke up last night was completely burried again this morning (couldn't even see her), BUT - she woke up again today and has spent the day swimming... so I'm just hoping the other will wake up soon, as soon as both are awake we're going to give them an aquatic environement with a large floating dock.

I really can't wait to post the pictures - it sounds like this is unusual.

[jozzep]

The one that woke up last night was completely burried again this morning (couldn't even see her), BUT - she woke up again today and has spent the day swimming... so I'm just hoping the other will wake up soon, as soon as both are awake we're going to give them an aquatic environment with a large floating dock.

I really can't wait to post the pictures - it sounds like this is unusual.

It does sound very unusual....I think the turtles are messed up from the previous owner because their enclosure sounds more like a box turtle or tortoise habitat with a dirt area and a bowl for them to get wet in.RES are VERY aquatic and should only leave the water (which should be a lot more than a bowl or little tub) to bask or lay eggs.
Sounds like you're on the right track and view the "picture gallery" to see what an RES habitat looks like.
Please post pictures of their enclosure....

[mike hill]

Turt-kp-48 If your turtle is 4-1/2" turtle and in a 20 gallon: it is too small. The gallons per inch is 10 and a 50 to 55 is about right. The temp. should be about 75 to 77 degrees with good filtration. Good Luck! m.

[TurtleKeeper48]

So, here they are:

close up:

[TurtleKeeper48]

My son's turtle - Rosa:

She seems happy


She usually has more water than this

[TurtleKeeper48]

Okay - last pics. This is what they looked like earlier today. At last check, just a few minutes ago, the one seen in the water was hanging out on the "bridge" and scurried back into the bedding area when I came in. (edit - then back to the water again at next check)


She did eat pretty good yesterday, but mostly hung out like in this picture today.
Best shot I could get of the big one that's still "sleeping"

[TurtleKeeper48]

We really want to give these two turtles a home make-over and get their tank set up like Rosa's tank. (only bigger)

At this point we are just waiting to have them both awake so we can make the switch. I have to admit - We are very tempted to just do it - to just take them out, asleep or not, and set up the tank with water, and then just place them on the basking area asleep or agitated or whetever, and let them do whatever they want... but we're trying to be patient and let them "wake up" on their own.

They really aren't asleep - they move a little bit now and then (often to dig in deeper) and if you try to disturb them, they try to scurry and might even make a slight hissing sound.

Any ideas what I should do next?

[Caphits]

They arent asleep. They are trying to hide. The water isnt deep enough for them to feel secure, so they are trying to dig. Once you get them in a tank with enough water, they will be much less scared.

I know they arent asleep anymore, because the temperature is around 90 degrees.